saskduckfan
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Posts posted by saskduckfan
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28 minutes ago, ike8228 said:
It is an auto fill the boards do. If you type the S word, it automatically changes. That’s why you see it often.
watch
Dehydrated Donkey Dung
I typed the actual word and it changed. Try it for yourself.
Did not know that. Thanks. No need to type the word.
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We seriously need a new saying besides dehydrated donkey dung. That's getting old fast seeing as how everything seems to be DDD.
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1 minute ago, perry_mvp said:
That's if Tampa offers him anything. Publicly there hasn't been anything said of keeping him there.
Briesebois was quoted back in Sept saying he was going to wait until the end of the season before renegotiating with Stamkos. Saying he would sit down with him at that time and figure out what is best for the club. Meaning, asking Stamkos to take a pay cut if he wants to stay.
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Just now, perry_mvp said:
I didn't say he needs to come here for the money but if he values himself more than a $3M contract with Tampa he'll go wherever is going to pay him more.
And maybe he values his lifestyle, home, location, and where he has started his family more then he values the money at this stage of his career.
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14 minutes ago, perry_mvp said:
That's ridiculous. If he retires from hockey before he turns 40, what job opportunities does he have? You think he's going to work at Tim Hortons? Look at Killorn. You know why he's in Anaheim and not being paid less in Montreal (his lifelong dream)? For money. His career earnings before coming to Anaheim was in the $30M range. Of course you're going to go to the place that offers you the most.
Comparing Killorn to Stamkos is ridiculous. A guy with career earnings of $30 mil vs $116.675 mil is comparing apples to oranges. Of course Killorn is going for the money, he hasn't earned all yet. Stamkos has earned $80mil more then Killorn in his career. He doesn't need the money. If he retires before 40, I bet there is a front office job in Tampa with his name on it. Will he work at Tim Hortons? No, he has earned $116 mil, he doesn't need to work ever. If you want to compare apples to apples, Ryan Getzlaf is a good example. A guy that also made $100mil over his playing career. Came off his big $66mil contract, was a UFA, had options to make a lot more money (Oilers were willing to offer him close to $7mil), play for more competitive teams, etc, but decided to sign for less, stay in Anaheim and retire a Duck as that is where he spent his entire career, started his family, etc. Sounds just like the Stamkos situation that he has now. I can guarantee he is not leaving Tampa and especially to chase money on a rebuilding team. If you think he is coming here for a big pay day because he needs it, then that is the ridiculous statement.
Killorn also has very little money made in endorsement deals, if any. Stamkos has made a ton off of endorsements as well. Stamkos has endorsements with Nike, Tissot Watches, EA Sports, Sport Check, Coca-cola, etc. Killorn has none.
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1 hour ago, perry_mvp said:
Just to be technically correct, Stamkos turned 34 in February. He makes the Ducks better by making the kids more competitive. Replace Kucherov with Gauthier or Carlsson. That will make them better. He's also a winner. The team needs more of those to change the culture.
If your choices are a $9M contract in Tampa, $15M in Detroit or $25M in Anaheim which do you think helps your family financially the most? He's already won cups. He's already a HHOF candidate. If he's really thinking about the best for his family, he'll go to the place where he will make more.
You really think he is looking for a big pay day to be financially sound for his family? He doesn't need it. He's had contracts of $11.175 mil, $37.5 mil, and $68mil. You dont think that $116.675 mil is enough to financially support his family? He also is listed with a net worth of $14mil which is more then any of us will see in our lifetime. I think his family is pretty financially secure already. Not to mention the amount of money that he would have made on endorsements. The guy is already financially sound for his family. Stamkos is not going to leave Tampa. I guarantee he will resign with them for less then he would probably get on the open market. Why? Because he doesn't need the money and his life is in Tampa Bay.
Gauthier or Carlsson are not Kucherov. I don't see Gauthier or Carlsson hitting 150 points in any of the 3 seasons people want Stamkos for, if ever. So you can't call Gauthier or Carlsson a replacement for Kucherov. We dont have a player the likes of Kucherov. And if Stamkos came here, he would draw more attention and his numbers would drop, plain and simple. I also don't know how one player makes the rest of the team more competitive. He could come into the team and the players that took all the lazy and dumb penalties continue to do so. Just because Stamkos is here doesnt mean players will play better because of it. They may choose not to.
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For those that think the draft lottery is rigged, keep in mind the Oilers got Connor McDavid from the lottery. If the NHL riggs the lottery, why would they put their best player way up in Edmonton and not in some major market in the US to showcase their game. Same with Auston Matthews, why would they let him go to Toronto a team that will sell out every game regardless if they are good or not instead of somewhere else. I hated Chicago got Bedard as they should have lost the pick as punishment for their assault cover up, but the lottery is anything from rigged. Luck plays a big part of it.
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13 hours ago, PlzInsertLiquor said:
I guess I’m just confused, Stamkos makes us a better team, but you only want him at an unrealistic number. And if we overpay him for 3 years it does nothing to hurt our future cap situation.
id also argue Gudas / Vats / Killorn have all made us a better team. Strome I personally believe is a very serviceable 3rd liner who’s been forced to play above his ability.
he traded those players because they were UFA’s and he wanted to bottom out instead of middling and signing Lindholm to an 8 year deal into his late 30’s was not the play 2-1/2 years ago.
as far as the trades goes, I think you are in the minority that he is losing all of them. He may have not gotten enough in your opinion, and that’s fair but like we’ve said before neither of us know what he asked for or what he was offered. And then later on though you want him to lower his asking price on Gibson and even give up assets to move a very serviceable NHL goalie. That honestly seems counterintuitive to building an improved roster. Trade a starting goalie, lowering your asking price, move assets to do it, eat some of his contract, just seems like a negative trade in my mind.
and i just want to know what is a move that makes sense to you ? You don’t have any UFA’s you’d like him to sign ?
I don't want him to lower the asking price for Gibson, or even trade him. Just let Gibson play out as your backup. I said if nobody is willing to offer Verbeek's asking price for Gibson and he really wants to dump the contract, then he will have to lower his asking price to dump him.
Gudas is the only player that made the Ducks better. Vatrano is listed because he almost scored 40 this year. Did he score 40 last year? No. Did he take a bunch of stupid penalties over and over? Yes. Did that make the Ducks better? No as they lost games because they needed to kill his penalties. Verbeek said Killorn was brought in for penalty killing. Did he make the penalty kill better? No, they were worse then last year. So that didn't work. Vatrano, Killorn, and Strome are all playing too high in the lineup.
And how does an aging 35 year old Stamkos make the Ducks better? Sure he put up 40 goals and 81 points which on paper makes the Ducks better, but take him out of that system and away from his setup man Kucherov (who put up 144 points) does he continue to have the same success or does his production drop significantly? I think his production drops. Teams are so focused on Kucherov that Stamkos gets open and he produces. Who do the Ducks have that is a comparison to a 144 point Nikita Kucherov? The Stamkos/Kucherov in Tampa is the same as McDavid/Hyman in Edmonton. On any other team Hyman does not put up 50+ goals, but teams focus so much on McDavid that Hyman is available. And better yet, how does bringing in an aging Stamkos for only 3 years until he is 38 and then telling him to take a hike help? I'm sure if that's the plan the player will be thrilled to move his family for 2 seasons, likely get traded in the third season and then do it all over again. If I'm a player and the negotiation is a 3 year contract and knowing you aren't getting resigned due to the raises coming to the core players I'm not looking at your team. I want to play in the playoffs, compete for a cup, and the Ducks are not doing that in the next 3 seasons with or without Stamkos. The guy will be thinking what is best for his family at this point in time in his career and I can fully see him resigning in Tampa for $3mil a season just so he doesn't have to move his family. He has played his entire career there. Had a chance to leave with his last contract, and left more money on the table then to stay in Tampa. Now he is going to take more and leave. I highly doubt it.
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8 minutes ago, perry_mvp said:
That just means you can't trade him elsewhere without his approval. If Fowler really wants a playoff run, you can ask him to waive his clause if the trade is to a team not on the list.
Exactly, you can ask him. But if he is comfortable in the situation he is in, doesn't want to move his family, doesn't care about a playoff run, then your only option is one of four teams. He could be a player where his opinion is I am going nowhere unless it is one of those 4 only.
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33 minutes ago, FanSince1993 said:
Agree with every single word you said. Question though: how do you get rid of FOWLer and Gibson? Who is going to take them? It's not Verbeek's fault that nobody wants them, it The Barstool Bob who signed them to these ridiculous contracts. So, the Ducks just have to ride them until their contracts expire, although I do them buying out the last year of Gibson's contact.
Fowler you can't trade. Bob gave him that ridiculous no trade clause where there are only 4 teams he will accept a trade to. So unless he is willing to move from those 4 teams, then the hope it that one of those 4 teams wants him. If not, then you're stuck and you either ride him out in a lower roll or buy out. Less minutes and a second pair defenseman with a solid partner and Fowler wouldn't look as bad as he has.
Gibson, you have to move off your ask. If Verbeek was looking for a high pick and top prospect to retain on Gibson, then maybe you have to move to taking a mid round pick only with no retention just to move him, if someone is willing to do that. Or an even lower pick and adding a mid round pick as a sweetener if you really want to dump the player and contract. But even that doesn't work all the time (Oilers with Jack Campbell).
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On 4/26/2024 at 4:45 PM, PlzInsertLiquor said:
I guess I’m asking, since you believe stats mean everything in this world. How would you react if GMPV traded for Necas, who scored 18 less points this year. Worse than Troy Terry. And then signed him to a similar contract to Terry.
remember you started this thread. Par Verbeek is the worse GM in ducks history. I’m trying to figure out what you want him to do. Trade for someone who underperformed this year ? You then say Stamkos will never come, but if he does come, what would you say, awful decision he’s old and past his prime.
as the man who started the thread calling him the worst GM ever. I’m more interested in what he needs to do (specific moves) that would change your mind.
If Stamkos comes at a reasonable price, then I would take him. Like the Selanne 1 year contract for $1mil to show he still has game. At 35 years old signing Stamkos to his final NHL contract at $8mil per season, no thanks, as I believe that once he is removed from Kucherov his numbers will drop significantly. Yes he put up 40 goals but with Kuch setting him up all the time that's one thing. Who do the Ducks have that is comparable to Kucherov? Nobody. So if you sign Stamkos to a 3 year $8mil contract and now he puts up 19 goals and 45 points, is it worth it? I see Stamkos resigning in Tampa for less then he currently makes and finishing his career with one franchise.
I dont have specific moves, but he needs to make moves that actually improve this team. He has talked about players being traded away because of their age and being older when the rebuild timeline is complete, so I don't know how signing a 35 year old player would fit anywhere near those plans. He needs to quit losing all his trades and quit making terrible coaching hires, and have the guts to fire someone when they don't perform. So far the moves that he has made are just bringing in warm bodies and doing nothing for the team. He needs to start making moves that make sense and make the team better.
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56 minutes ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:
Fiala is far superior player than Necas which is why you aren’t giving up the same value for him. Also, the prospect depends who Carolina would want and they are absolutely fine on defense with morrow and Nishkin in their system. They’d likely be targeting a forward rather than Luneau or Warren, which is why I mentioned Myatovic, Terrance who have close draft slots up Faber as 2nd round picks. I think they’d prefer an actual NHL player since they are in their contending window right now rather than futures which is why I mentioned the Vatrano alternative. Odds are Necas stays in Carolina but it’s good to monitor that situation.
I agree that the Ducks will have to trade something decent to get a top-6 forward. That’s why I listed what recent top-6 forwards have been traded for. Zegras is better than decent and still hasn’t hit his potential. He was a Calder trophy finalist. They aren’t trading him this offseason unless he really wants out now and they are getting an elite asset back which Necas is not and adding a late first doesn’t equal one either imo.
We discussed in the Gauthier thread that if verbeek could have gotten Gauthier straight up for drysdale then he would have. Other teams were making offers and adding a 2nd round pick in 2025 is worth it for one of the best offensive prospects in hockey. If we are worried about next years 2nd round pick then we truly are screwed. Plus, we could easily recoup that in a Vatrano trade at the TDL.
If the Ducks somehow got Celebrini that doesn’t mean that it will force the Ducks into a trade this summer because of the overload at center. It could in future seasons but If they did then it’ll be because they got too good of an offer to refuse. Of course, we ain’t getting him. I think we are only team in the NHL (sans Vegas) to never move up in the draft lottery
Good post, just two issues though. You mention Carolina would want a forward prospect and then toss the names Myatovic and Terrance out, who are both prospects that Ducks fans sit there and go "I have no idea why Verbeek picked these guys when he did when there was better available". It seems there are lots of people here that question those two picks and just because Myatovic was picked in the 2nd round does not mean he is going to be a good player. He really didn't do much in his short time in the AHL so I would not be valuing him very high that him and a late 1st are going to get a top 6 forward.
The second, you mention being worried about next years 2nd round pick and it being recouped in a Vatrano trade at the TDL. The problem with that is if you are trading next years second or whatever for a top 6 right wing, your plan is to be competing for the playoffs and if by somehow that is the case for the Ducks at the TDL, you don't trade your assets. So no, they would not recoup the pick for Vatrano and if they did trade him at the TDL and were in a playoff spot, then the reasoning would be because he is having a down year and not doing much which then would not warrant a second round pick.
As for the lottery, you can argue that the Ducks have moved up in the draft lottery. 2005 draft, Ducks went from being 22nd in the league which would have been the 9th pick to 2nd overall. Although that draft was done a little differently the argument can be made the Ducks did move up.
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38 minutes ago, Sexlaf15 said:
I swear man, once you learn to speak to people in less of a condescending way, the world is your oyster!
It’s a little more intentional than random wishful thinking. 5 of them are FA and the others are assortments of players who have publicly been on the outs to varying degrees and/or players on rebuilding teams or on a team that might be rebuilding.
As for Laine, I agree he’s probably overpayed, but his contract is irrelevant to anyone not named Henry and/or Susan Samueli. It’s for 2 more seasons after this. Ducks are porbably flirting with the cap floor next season and it’s up before any of the big RFAs need to be paid. That actually helps the ducks case as they’re one of the only teams that can take the full cap hit and not need to ask for retention. Maine has been just about a PPG player for Columbus outside of this last year. Just hasn’t been able to stay healthy. He has warts, but he’s 26 and fits in with the age of the core, wicked shot, shoots right handed and is big. I think most of the guys available are probably going to have some level of warts.
One, the first part is a joke. Hahaha. In no way is it serious.
Two, I go on to explain why to stay away from Laine and who the most realistic targets are. The FA's could be targets, but there will be others in on them and there is probably a very good chance none of those top FA choose Anaheim unfortunately.
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1 hour ago, Sexlaf15 said:
So targets that meet the basic RH Top 6 Winger that can be realistic targets.
Martin Necas - trade
Patrik Laine - trade
Steven Stamkos - FA
Jonathan Marchessault - FA
Mitch Marner - trade
Sam Reinhart - FA
Viktor Arvidsson - FA
Tyler Toffoli - FA
Complete guess territory based in guessing if a team might be start rebuilding or willing to trade an established wingerKyle Palmieri
Travis Konecny - really doubt this one, but man he’s a Verbeek guy
most of these are just guesses to varying degrees. So spare the “this guy would never come here” that gets posted any time anyone identifies a player they like
Well if we are just identifying players that we like that we wish to come to the Ducks, then add McDavid, Draisaitl, and Bedard to your list. Those guys would look good in Ducks colors and likely only cost a mid pick and player like Lacombe or Fowler to get them.
In all seriousness, I would stay far, far away from Laine. He has shown nothing since he left the Jets, other then it would be another team trading him away this early in his career. High salary too with nothing to back it up the last few years besides injuries. He is a hard pass at $8mil per season. At $4mil for a year, might be worth a try, but not his current length and salary.
I see Necas and Konecny as realistic targets.
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10 hours ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:
Were the Fiala and and Debrincat trades jokes? Those actually happened and nothing close to Zegras was involved to get either player. Do you think Necas is more valuable than they are?
No they were not jokes, but the Ducks do not have what would be the equivalent of those returns that they would be willing to trade. Use Fiala, so Faber and a mid 1st round pick in 2022 which was 19th overall in a bit stronger draft class. So trying to find a similar return from the Ducks would be Luneau and not sure where that mid 1st is. The Oilers first could end up being 29th overall in a weak draft. Even at 21st or 22nd or whatever it is, this draft is still considered to be weak. Does it hold the same value as 19th in a draft that was stronger then this one? Probably not. So now you have to add as well. Does Verbeek trade Luneau? A RHD that sounds like he has big plans for. Probably not. So what does that leave? Noah Warren, an unproven defenseman in the NHL. Ok so now you need Warren and more to make the trade. He is nowhere near considered one of our top prospects. So now you are looking at Warren and maybe next year's first top 5 protected. But then Verbeek is giving up his precious 1st round pick. Can't see that happening. Warren and a 2nd is nowhere close to fair value. Or does Verbeek work on a trade with a player he had issues with in signing and both sides have hard feelings for each other. A guy that the coach likes to bench and single out, a coach hand picked by Verbeek. Hmmm, maybe we are onto something, especially if Verbeek can get more out of Carolina. Hey look, Anaheim has an abundance of centers on the team and is a strength to trade from. Do you see McTavish, Carlsson, or Zegras as a 3rd line center and being happy about it? Didn't think so. Zegras has already said he would rather play center vs wing. So you stick him on the wing, his contract ends, and he bolts because he wants to be a center. Or does Verbeek make a trade from strength for a need. Ducks need a top 6 right shot winger. In order to get that the Ducks will have to trade something decent. Verbeek gave up Drysdale AND a 2nd for Cutter, who was a player demanding a trade. Verbeek could have easily gone one for one with that one. So we already have past instances where Verbeek gives up more in trades.
So with an overload of centers, and lets say the Ducks win the lottery and add Celebrini, can you see a trade of the second problem hold out, who publicly stated he wasnt happy with negotiations last summer. He already traded the other. I can easily see Verbeek offering Zegras in return for Necas and a 2nd or Necas and a first with another add from the Ducks or Necas and a prospect. It doesnt have to be a one for one trade, but I can easily see the framework of a trade worked around those two.
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1 hour ago, PlzInsertLiquor said:
But would you say you think we shouldn’t trade for Necas because he went from 71 pts to 53 pts and clearly is regressing. Wouldn’t you agree that trading for him would make GMPV dumb, because obviously why would you ever trade for someone who is clearly regressing.
I dont even know what point you are trying to make or argue so I'll ignore and move on.
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1 hour ago, ike8228 said:
Not meaning to go too much into the captain topic of other threads, but related to this thread, the #1 factor for me in FA related to Stamkos is I believe he instantly becomes the captain. Say what you want about all the other guys on the lists above, Stamkos has Captain experience to boot. He just makes too much sense for this group and he has history with Duh’Beeker. I’m not saying he actually comes here, but I would bet all the shiny pennys I can find that Beeks goes hard for him.
Again, trying not to digress the FA thread, but Beek made it clear they are naming a captain THIS SUMMER. He didn’t say training camp, he didn’t say preseason. Summer. Sounds like a summer acquisition to me. FA…we have debated who is or isn’t captain material and I just don’t see it from anyone yet. Sorry but I disagree with the recent surge in Z votes on the board. Signing Stamkos addresses the captain issue, scoring more goals issue, PP production issue, right shot issue, winger? maybe not or he does or Z slides to RW idk.
It just checks too many boxes to ignore.
Verbeek will go after him but he wont come. 35 year old that will want to compete and win his last few years, not go to a rebuilding team and not sniff the playoffs the last few years. I bet Stamkos takes less money for a contender. He has had his big pay day already. And take Kucherov away from him and who says he produces anywhere near the same rate. Killorn didnt.
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30 minutes ago, PlzInsertLiquor said:
My question to you Sask, if you complain about Zegras taking a step back, even though he started the season hurt, played poorly, went on the IR. Came back played well, broke his foot. Came back and played very well. And you think his season wasn’t good enough and he’s taken a step back.
What would you be saying if Necas was on our team, he went from 71 pts last year to 53 pts and a -9. You’d blame GMPV for trading for someone who clearly sucks right ?
I'm not the one on here saying we should trade for him. I'm just saying Carolina holds more value in this guy then a 2nd round pick and Vatrano. Maybe that offer gets it done if Vatrano has more then one season of 36 goals and isnt a pending UFA that Carolina has to open their wallets for and isnt 30 years old. The Canes have more value in Necas then that or a late 1st in a weak draft and one of our B prospects that we question ourselves why we drafted them.
Im saying those offers would never get Necas. Vatrano and a 2nd or Oilers 1st and one of Terrance or Myatovic. Those are jokes. The Hurricanes would value their guy closer to Zegras and any trade would start with a player along that caliber coming back, or the Ducks top 5 pick. Would it ge one for one, doubtful, but something like Necas and a 3rd or prospect for Zegras is probably pretty close.
Remember the Ducks need a top 6 righ shot RW and have an overflow of top 6 centers.
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29 minutes ago, g20topdogg said:
Yeah but that's the thing, Zegras was injured and played injured so of course his stats are going to be bad. Besides you just compared stats from a guy on a rebuilding team that's been bad to a guy on a playoff contender. Those are very different scenarios. But even with his down year Zegras has 15 more points in 4 less games.
I did not count this past season. That was the previous two seasons, 2021-22 and 2022-23.
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1 hour ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:
That he was injured and missed over 50 games. Necas missed 5 games this year.
I know thats why I took his point total over 82 games. The previous two seasons Zegras had 156GP 46G 80A 126P -45 and Necas 160GP 42G 69A 111P +10. There is not much difference stat wise between the two and each one if their teams likely holds them to similar value.
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7 minutes ago, Sexlaf15 said:
Could’ve said the same thing for Killorn and Gudas
No you couldnt honestly. I saw Killorn coming to the Ducks from a mile away and both him and Gudas seem to me are guys that would take a big pay day over winning as neither one of them has made huge earnings during their playing careers as they weren't star players. Stamkos and Marchessault have made huge earnings and likely would rather win again before they retire so will take less for the opportunity instead of coming here, kind of like what Corey Perry does every year with a contender. Made his money with the Ducks now signs for cheap with teams that can win.
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Guarantee Stamkos or Marchessault are not Ducks next year. Nice to dream, but both players will look to play on better teams and win the cup to end their careers. I would even expect both to take less money for a chance to win as they have made their career earnings already, instead of riding into the sunset on a rebuilding team that won't be in the playoffs before those 3-4 year contracts are up.
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23 hours ago, tommer-1 said:
Which is exactly what Verbeek would do if CAR called wanting Zegras for Necas.
Or he accepts the trade due to the issues he has had with Zegras in the past and this is a way out, especially if Carolina adds a 3rd round pick too. There are still rumors out there that the two sides (Zegras and Verbeek) don't exactly see eye to eye and the Ducks may still be looking to trade him this off season, despite what Verbeek says in the press.
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23 hours ago, BombaysTripleDeke said:
What comp are you using to show that Necas could command Zegras in a return?
Again, look at what fiala (19th overall and Brock faber before he played a NHL game) went for and even the Debrincat trade to Detroit (conditional 1st in 2024) Kubalik, a guy drafted in the 3rd round in 2020 and a 4th round pick. Is Necas better than them? I don’t think he is at all.
Necas had an 18 point drop off from last season (71 points to 53). Over the last 3 seasons he has a total of 164 points compared to Debrincat who has 211 and fiala who has 230. Necas should cost less than those guys imo
Zegras had a 50 point drop from last season to this season and if you factor his PPG based on 82 games he would have been on pace for 40 points, a 25 point drop. Your point?
Verbeek = Worst GM in Ducks History
in Anaheim Ducks
Posted
LOL!!!! That's the priority. Sign another aging veteran to an expensive contract. He isn't coming here at all. If Verbeek is going to toss the money needed at Stamkos, then toss it at Reinhart, at least the age works out there.